News4 mins ago
Uk Democracy Under Threat
I only became aware of this today, that the government has voter ID plans whereby in order to vote at polling stations, voters will be required to show official photo ID (such as a passport, driver’s licence etc).
Many people do not hold such ID and will therefore be disenfranchised as a result of this legislation which is likely to impact the poorer sections of our society. Quite why the Labour Party is not up in arms against such plans I don’t know.
You can read more here:-
https:/ /www.cr owdjust ice.com /case/d efendin g-our-d emocrac y-say-n o-to-vo ter-id/ ?utm_so urce=Cr owdJust ice& ;utm_ca mpaign= 9b33037 f9d-VOT IDMAR20 21& utm_med ium=ema il& utm_ter m=0_730 4756a43 -9b3303 7f9d-16 9393273
Many people do not hold such ID and will therefore be disenfranchised as a result of this legislation which is likely to impact the poorer sections of our society. Quite why the Labour Party is not up in arms against such plans I don’t know.
You can read more here:-
https:/
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No best answer has yet been selected by Hymie. Once a best answer has been selected, it will be shown here.
For more on marking an answer as the "Best Answer", please visit our FAQ.Togo – in your post timed at 21:44, you stated that the ID requirements were in the Tory manifesto and they (the Tories) were elected based on promising to do this – therefore it is democratic.
If the Tory manifesto stated that voting for anyone other than the Tories would be made illegal in their manifesto and they were elected based on this – you would claim it was democratic.
My view is that such a law would be undemocratic.
If the Tory manifesto stated that voting for anyone other than the Tories would be made illegal in their manifesto and they were elected based on this – you would claim it was democratic.
My view is that such a law would be undemocratic.
yeah Hyme
if the people vote that half the people shall not vote then it is still democratic
is internally inconsistent. I think we have got there.
Did happen in 1979 tho
Iran the leddies voted to disenfranchise themselves on the grounds a good wife weel vote as er husband says !
we wdnt call Iran democratic - - - er would we - - even on AB ?
if the people vote that half the people shall not vote then it is still democratic
is internally inconsistent. I think we have got there.
Did happen in 1979 tho
Iran the leddies voted to disenfranchise themselves on the grounds a good wife weel vote as er husband says !
we wdnt call Iran democratic - - - er would we - - even on AB ?
hymie: "If the Tory manifesto stated that voting for anyone other than the Tories would be made illegal in their manifesto and they were elected based on this – you would claim it was democratic.
My view is that such a law would be undemocratic. " - the way it was arrived at would be democratic, the result would remove democracy. If the people choose to remove democracy, then that itself would be democratic.
My view is that such a law would be undemocratic. " - the way it was arrived at would be democratic, the result would remove democracy. If the people choose to remove democracy, then that itself would be democratic.
//If the Tory manifesto stated that voting for anyone other than the Tories would be made illegal in their manifesto//
Not to worry ... I have got my eye on that for you. If it happens I will give you the nod. Meanwhile, a practical tip. When measuring a piece of string, lay it in a straight line. A circle is a bit to complicated for you.
Not to worry ... I have got my eye on that for you. If it happens I will give you the nod. Meanwhile, a practical tip. When measuring a piece of string, lay it in a straight line. A circle is a bit to complicated for you.
citizen card. £15
https:/ /www.ci tizenca rd.com/
https:/
Court of appeal dismissed it in 2020
https:/ /www.lo calgove rnmentl awyer.c o.uk/go vernanc e/396-g overnan ce-news /43978- court-o f-appea l-dismi sses-le gal-cha llenge- over-vo ter-id
https:/
o god I love AB - it is so crazy it makes me feel normal
and THAT is not easy
//All have a choice - that's democracy.// to vote or not
Nope! - er where to start
first one is a choice and the second (no votey if no ID) is not
AND
aus is a democracy and makes everyone vote - oudda country you have to go to the embassy/high commission. o god
People dont think enough before they write, that is their fault. My fault is I think too much ( thx to Oscar)
and THAT is not easy
//All have a choice - that's democracy.// to vote or not
Nope! - er where to start
first one is a choice and the second (no votey if no ID) is not
AND
aus is a democracy and makes everyone vote - oudda country you have to go to the embassy/high commission. o god
People dont think enough before they write, that is their fault. My fault is I think too much ( thx to Oscar)
//NJ read you short version. There are monitors now to control 1 ballot per person in a booth//
That was not an issue identified in the Lutfur Rahman ruling.
//mainstream - "they have a vote but they dont have a vote"//
Not quite Peter. They have a vote (for their MEP) but it does not “enfranchise” them in any meaningful way. But not only is that off topic, it’s now, thankfully, irrelevant to people in the UK.
//Based on the info in the link, 7.5% of the population would be disenfranchised//
You might as well say that those who fail to ensure they are included on the electoral roll are “disenfranchised.” Taking part in the activities of a society involves accepting responsibilities and places requirements of various sorts on its members. To see a doctor you must be registered with a GP; to travel abroad you must obtain a passport and produce it when asked; to drive you must obtain a licence and produce it when asked. To vote you must firstly ensure you are on the roll and henceforth you will be asked to identify yourself at the polling station. There’s nothing at all unreasonable in that. I’ve never quite understood how simply pitching up at the polling station and giving your name and address should be sufficient for you to be given a ballot paper. Supposing somebody impersonated Hymie without his knowledge and cast a vote before he got to the polling station. Hymie then pitches up:
Hymie: “I’m Mr Hymie of 41 Acacia Avenue.”
Polling Station Bod: “Sorry Mr Hymie, you’ve already voted.”
Hymie: “No I have not.”
Polling Station Bod: “My records show that you have. Sorry.” “Next!” [if he's lucky] or “Call the Police” [if he's not].
Voters will only be disenfranchised if they fail to comply with the conditions of the voting procedure. When I last voted my area was one of the “pilots” to require voter ID. It caused me no difficulties whatsoever.
//…this is a barrier on the day, of which the ONLY outcome is- fewer voters.//
Sorry, Peter, but I cannot imagine anybody who really wants to vote being put off by this requirement. If they are, bad luck. Things change and we have to change with them.
That was not an issue identified in the Lutfur Rahman ruling.
//mainstream - "they have a vote but they dont have a vote"//
Not quite Peter. They have a vote (for their MEP) but it does not “enfranchise” them in any meaningful way. But not only is that off topic, it’s now, thankfully, irrelevant to people in the UK.
//Based on the info in the link, 7.5% of the population would be disenfranchised//
You might as well say that those who fail to ensure they are included on the electoral roll are “disenfranchised.” Taking part in the activities of a society involves accepting responsibilities and places requirements of various sorts on its members. To see a doctor you must be registered with a GP; to travel abroad you must obtain a passport and produce it when asked; to drive you must obtain a licence and produce it when asked. To vote you must firstly ensure you are on the roll and henceforth you will be asked to identify yourself at the polling station. There’s nothing at all unreasonable in that. I’ve never quite understood how simply pitching up at the polling station and giving your name and address should be sufficient for you to be given a ballot paper. Supposing somebody impersonated Hymie without his knowledge and cast a vote before he got to the polling station. Hymie then pitches up:
Hymie: “I’m Mr Hymie of 41 Acacia Avenue.”
Polling Station Bod: “Sorry Mr Hymie, you’ve already voted.”
Hymie: “No I have not.”
Polling Station Bod: “My records show that you have. Sorry.” “Next!” [if he's lucky] or “Call the Police” [if he's not].
Voters will only be disenfranchised if they fail to comply with the conditions of the voting procedure. When I last voted my area was one of the “pilots” to require voter ID. It caused me no difficulties whatsoever.
//…this is a barrier on the day, of which the ONLY outcome is- fewer voters.//
Sorry, Peter, but I cannot imagine anybody who really wants to vote being put off by this requirement. If they are, bad luck. Things change and we have to change with them.